Industry minister talks TikTok, Elon Musk and the future of his AI bill

OTTAWA — As the federal government battles TikTok in court over Ottawa’s order to close its Canadian offices, Canada’s industry minister says families should make their own decisions about whether to continue using the app.

“Ultimately, that’s a choice for people to make with eyes wide open,” François-Philippe Champagne said.

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As for what he tells his own family? Champagne won’t share.

“I don’t want to give advice on my personal experience in the sense that that is a more broad-based issue…it’s like if you were asking about my eating habits, well, they may be well-suited for me and my family,” he said.

“My personal experience or my risk tolerance…might be very different than other people.”

Champagne made the comments in a wide-ranging year-end interview with The Canadian Press. The interview was conducted on Dec. 12, before the surprise resignation of former finance minister Chrystia Freeland raised questions about the fate of the Liberal government. Champagne, who has been industry minister since 2021, kept in post in a Dec. 20 cabinet shuffle.

In November, the federal government said that TikTok must close its operations in Canada after a national security review of the Chinese company behind the social media platform, though the app itself would remain available to Canadians.

The company filed a challenge in December, arguing in Federal Court that the decision was “unreasonable” and “driven by improper purposes.”

In the interview, Champagne said companies are free to launch a “legal challenge if they want, but it won’t detract me from my first job, which is to protect the national security of Canadians.”

He declined to specify what the deadline is for the company to wrap up operations.

Privacy and safety concerns around TikTok and its China-based parent company ByteDance Ltd. have centered around Chinese national security laws that compel organizations in the country to assist with intelligence gathering. Ottawa hasn’t outlined the specific national security reasons behind the shut-down order.

The review didn’t deal with the question of whether the app should be banned, Champagne indicated.

“There’s a huge difference between using an app and the activities you can conduct on the ground,” he said.

Champagne said the focus of the government’s order was “with respect to the activities that were conducted by TikTok in its offices in Canada.”

Asked whether that means there are no national security concerns about Canadians using the app or that the order just didn’t look at that question, Champagne responded: “under the law, my jurisdiction is with respect to the activities conducted in Canada by a foreign entity….That’s why I say there’s a difference between an app and the activities being conducted by employees in offices in Canada.”

Champagne said people should listen to advice that has “been given by security agencies both in Canada and abroad in making an informed decision for them or their children, if they really want to use these platforms.”

In May, David Vigneault, then the director of CSIS, said he personally would not recommend using the app.

TikTok wasn’t the only national security issue involving a high-profile company for Champagne this year.

In September, the Liberal government announced a $2.14 billion loan to Ottawa-based satellite operator Telesat, which is launching a constellation of low Earth orbit satellites that will be able to connect the most remote areas of the country to broadband internet.

The Conservatives tagged in American billionaire Elon Musk, who said he could provide connectivity for less than half that amount.

While Telesat said the exchange on Musk’s X platform didn’t reflect the reality of the government’s deal (for one, Telesat will give up 12 per cent equity in the company), Champagne accused the Conservatives of wanting to “sell out our national security.”

Musk has become an increasingly controversial and political figure in recent years. A supporter of incoming U.S. president Donald Trump, Musk has been tagged to co-lead a new “Department of Government Efficiency” and is emerging as a political force ahead of the presidential inauguration.

Trump has also caused upheaval for Canadian federal and provincial governments with his promise to impose 25 per cent tariffs. He has also repeatedly made references, generally dismissed as jokes, about Canada becoming the 51st state. Musk, meanwhile, recently called Prime Minister Justin Trudeau an “insufferable tool” in a post on X.

Asked whether his concerns about national security were about Starlink and Musk himself, Champagne responded: “I’ve met Elon. No, I think it’s more about favouring a Canadian champion. It’s not about the others, it’s about us…we have the chance to have one of the largest companies when it comes to satellite communication.”

He pointed to the need for secure communications in the north.

“We know that having secure communication in the Arctic and the North will be crucial for national security and when it comes to aviation, with navigation in the northern passage,” he said. “It’s important to have sovereignty when it comes to data and data links that may be used in the future.”

While telecom has always been a mainstay of the industry minister’s portfolio, a big part of Champagne’s focus has been on artificial intelligence — both the promise it holds for Canadian businesses and the need to put regulations in place to contain its dangers.

In 2022, Champagne introduced AI regulation Bill C-27, targeting “high-impact” AI systems. The government later proposed amendments to the bill, including a definition of “high-impact,” which would include systems used in law enforcement, health care or decisions around employment.

But it still hasn’t become law; critics said the government was initially slow to move it through the parliamentary process, as the Liberals prioritized other internet regulation legislation.

Once it did make it to committee for a study, it’s been bogged down in the clause-by-clause process that has stretched on since April and saw the Liberals and Conservatives accuse each other of filibustering.

Champagne says he has been in contact with the opposition parties to try to get the bill through.

“There have been discussions with parties to say, ok, how can we come together and deliver something that might not be perfect, but that would be better than what we have today.”

He described those discussions as a “work in progress.”

“We started from a base which was more political, to now something that I hope we can move beyond political lines.”

AI regulation is part of building trust in the technology, something that Champagne says is necessary to unleash AI as the “holy grail of productivity.” Champagne has also introduced a voluntary industry code of conduct, and in November launched a research centre that will study the dangers posed by artificial intelligence technology.

“And in order to build trust, you need guardrails, you need a framework. And when you have trust, then you’re going to have more adoption, which is going to lead to more innovation. So it’s really from fear to opportunity,” he said.

“If you and I were to go out in the street today, I think the jury is still out as to how many people would think that AI will be a force for good for humanity.”

This report by The Canadian Press was first published Jan. 3, 2025.

Anja Karadeglija, The Canadian Press